Help - Search - Member List - Calendar
Full Version: Kobe/Lebron/Jordan
Collector Zone > Collector Corner > Hobby Talk
kobelover_24
We all can go all day about this thread..lol I want to hear opinons..
I dont want this to be a dirty thread with bad comments.. this is all opinons...And please dont try to be bias i want to hear what you think.. thanks alot

Well this is how i see it...

PF-Lebron 6 8' 250 pounds-He is more solid and bigger he can take it to the house with more power then kobe. he a great shooter but not near as good as kobe.He makes his teammates better. Espeacilly on the 06-07 season he proved it taking his team to the championship game by himself. But then again in the 07-08 season he didnt make it there and seemed to choke in the playoffs.. Lebron is a great player shoot one of the best players to play in the game and he has like another 15 years... but so far i would take kobe as the best basketball player between the 2.



SG-kobe 6 6' 220 pounds-Purest shooter ever in the NBA. Could make the shot from everywhere. He could take it to the lane but not as powerful as lebron. He trusting his teammates now with the ball and dont need to score his 50 points every game. I need to get this off my chest HE IS NOT A BALLHOG! when he past it to his teammates they ethier miss layups (lamar odom), Loose the ball (kwame brown), or get Turnovers. He hasnt trust his team in the 03-06 season. as ou seen in 07-08 season he started trusting his teamamtes with the ball. Made it to the championship then lost to the celtics.. For the team he had he accomplished alot that year and finally winning the MVP. Kobe and Lebron are clearly 2 diffrent players on the court.. but they are also 2 best player on the court.. Kobe clearly has more experience and been playing longer then him. So far i would say Kobe is the better player that you will want over anybody today..

JORDAN
Did you watch jordan when he was nobody? did you watch him when he used to get killed by the pistons? After everyone got old. lakers, pistons, celtics and everyone retired or was after there prime.. Jordan didnt make a name for himself till everyone left or was old.. If jordan was playing with chris paul, kobe, lebron, KG..etc he would be not the best player ever.. there was no one amazing in the 90's ... Im not saying MJ was trash but he IS NOT the best basketball player ever.. Some people forget about MAGIC< BIRD< CHAMBERLAIN<KOBE<LEBRON<DR.J...etc i can go on all day.. MJ was in his prime when there was no one that was great like him.. all im saying he is not the best ever

But were talking about kobe/lebron/MJ/Iverson you forgot one of the best PG in the leauge.. CHRIS PAUL..Then we can go all day with that kid.. well i dont know if this make any sense to anyone what i just said but thats how i see it..
Kmart6nets
Seriously? Jordan. End of discussion.
10alex10
Jordan hands down!!
bigalexx
Lebron James is not a PF wink.gif.

When was Michael Jordan a nobody? Lets take a look at his stats as a Rookie.
82 GS 28.2 PPG .515 FG% 5.9 APG 6.5 RPG

Those sure are the stats of a nobody rolleyes.gif

Lebron James has never shot over .484 FG% in any season so far in his career, and Kobe has never shot over .469 FG% in any season in his career.

Would you call these players nobody's? David Robinson, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, John Stockton, Karl Malone, Julius Erving, Charles Barkley, Dominique Wilkins, Patrick Ewing, James Worth. Those are just some of the great players that Jordan has played with over his career.
kobelover_24
QUOTE(bigalexx @ Oct 28 2008, 02:56 PM)
Lebron James is not a PF wink.gif.

When was Michael Jordan a nobody? Lets take a look at his stats as a Rookie.
82 GS 28.2 PPG .515 FG% 5.9 APG 6.5 RPG

Those sure are the stats of a nobody rolleyes.gif

Lebron James has never shot over .484 FG% in any season so far in his career, and Kobe has never shot over .469 FG% in any season in his career.

Would you call these players nobody's? David Robinson, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, John Stockton, Karl Malone, Julius Erving, Charles Barkley, Dominique Wilkins, Patrick Ewing, James Worth. Those are just some of the great players that Jordan has played with over his career.
*


but you dont get he was playing when the guys were older and not in there prime... thats what im rying to say.... hes not the best basketball player ever.. if it wasnt for rodman he wouldnt have as many championship as he has now...
tex333
No Bias eh? Lebron is one if not the worst clutch shooter's in the game. I'd like to see him hit some shots outside of the paint and shoot above 48% before you crown him even in the top 50 of all time. But can you seriously talk about MJ when he was in his prime right when you were born? If you watched him in his prime and not on some re run on ESPN classic you would see what everyone else is talking about.

Kobe is a great shooter, but not the best. He's up in the top 3, but I'd argue that he wasn't even the best on his own team during the championship run.
tex333
Also, the East Lebron "led" the Cavs through was one of the worst of all time. Just thought I'd throw that out there if your going to be talking about MJ's level of competition. The thing is, the NBA was way more physical 15 years ago. Something you most likely wouldn't know unless you grew up during that time and compared to the joke the NBA is now.
booth9919
jordon hands down no ? asked
snkpoct137
no one will ever be good as jordan... period.
chopinalex
dang! I dont even like Jordan and I say he is no. 1
bigalexx
QUOTE(tex333 @ Oct 28 2008, 05:22 PM)
The thing is, the NBA was way more physical 15 years ago. Something you most likely wouldn't know unless you grew up during that time and compared to the joke the NBA is now.
*


Exactly! The only reason it is said for their to be better "stars" now is because now the NBA is all about protecting the superstar. The game is nowhere near as physical as it used to be.

kobelover_24
before i answer tex i want to here why you think he is the best guys... alright tex your up..

So as i see you dont like lebron.. you think he is trash? I wasnt born when mj was in his prime.. but i watch alot of classic games and just listen around to old timers.. I just dont think mj is the best ever.. When he was loosing to the detroit bad boys he gave up.. Pippen and mj were out of there game.. they couldnt beat them.. mj faking like he was hurt... pippen didnt want to play ethier.. intill detroit,lakers,celtics etc gotten old and out of there prime.. You here of MJ and the chicago bulls.. Then they went on there roll finally beating the bad boys.. Thhen Rodman help pippen and jordan a ton to help mj get his titles... im not saying mj is trash i think he was just the only great player in the 90's and if he was playing in the nba now he wouldnt be the best basketball player..


Also i dont want this to be a bias thread just becuase you like lebron/kobe/jordan that you think one of them are the best.. i want to hear why you think they are and some facts...

Thanks alot tex
kobelover_24
QUOTE(bigalexx @ Oct 28 2008, 05:05 PM)
Exactly! The only reason it is said for their to be better "stars" now is because now the NBA is all about protecting the superstar. The game is nowhere near as physical as it used to be.
*


So you saying the 90's was more physical then today? well i know jordan and pippen didnt like someone near them... if jordan misses they think its a foul becuase there is no way he can miss... Utah jazz game when he hit that buzzer shot to beat them.. he pushed off.. they dont call offenses of fouls on him.. but if lebron or kobe push off there calling a offensive foul and the jazz would of gotten the championship... im saying they wont let you gaurd mj they call ticky tack fouls..
tex333
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 07:11 PM)
So you saying the 90's was more physical then today? well i know jordan and pippen didnt like someone near them... if jordan misses they think its a foul becuase there is no way he can miss... Utah jazz game when he hit that buzzer shot to beat them.. he pushed off.. they dont call offenses of fouls on him.. but if lebron or kobe push off there calling a offensive foul and the jazz would of gotten the championship... im saying they wont let you gaurd mj they call ticky tack fouls..
*


You obviously haven't been watching the NBA very close have you?
Ilovetheheat
It is almost impossible to compare players who play different positions.

Peace
Jeremy
kobelover_24
QUOTE(Ilovetheheat @ Oct 28 2008, 05:14 PM)
It is almost impossible to compare players who play different positions.

Peace
Jeremy
*


I agree with you a 100%...
kobelover_24
QUOTE(tex333 @ Oct 28 2008, 05:13 PM)
You obviously haven't been watching the NBA very close have you?
*


i have..
tex333
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 07:06 PM)
before i answer tex i want to here why you think he is the best guys... alright tex your up..

So as i see you dont like lebron.. you think he is trash? I wasnt born when mj was in his prime.. but i watch alot of classic games and just listen around to old timers.. I just dont think mj is the best ever.. When he was loosing to the detroit bad boys he gave up.. Pippen and mj were out of there game.. they couldnt beat them.. mj faking like he was hurt... pippen didnt want to play ethier.. intill detroit,lakers,celtics etc gotten old and out of there prime.. You here of MJ and the chicago bulls.. Then they went on there roll finally beating the bad boys.. Thhen Rodman help pippen and jordan a ton to help mj get his titles... im not saying mj is trash i think he was just the only great player in the 90's and if he was playing in the nba now he wouldnt be the best basketball player..
Also i dont want this to be a bias thread just becuase you like lebron/kobe/jordan that you think one of them are the best.. i want to hear why you think they are and some facts...

Thanks alot tex
*


1. I gave you facts and Alex did too. You chose not to respond to them and that's your fault, not mine.
2. MJ Never faked he was hurt. That's a myth never proven. Kind of like Kobe in Colorado wink.gif
3. When did I say I didn't like LeBron and though he was trash? I like LeBron, I just think he's incredibly over rated.
4. The Bulls beat the Bad Boys because they got a decent coach in Phil Jackson. MJ,Pippen and Rodman were not the only people on that team. The bench on that team would be starting on most teams in the NBA right now.
5. If you dont want it to become a biased thread, dont start that by ignoring the facts. wink.gif

K THX
tex333
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 07:16 PM)
i have..
*


Then you would see that LeBron and Kobe get almost all the call's.
sgmco
Anyone who witnessed MJ's career and doesn't rate him the best ever---how can I say it--don't know jack. It's natural that you being a Kobe lover you would rate him above MJ---fact is either you were not there to witness MJ ORRRR you are a true Kobe lover. Either way ask those in the know and MJ will always come out on top.
kobelover_24
QUOTE(tex333 @ Oct 28 2008, 05:18 PM)
1. I gave you facts and  Alex did too. You chose not to respond to them and that's your fault, not mine.
2. MJ Never faked he was hurt. That's a myth never proven. Kind of like Kobe in Colorado wink.gif
3. When did I say I didn't like LeBron and though he was trash? I like LeBron, I just think he's incredibly over rated.
4. The Bulls beat the Bad Boys because they got a decent coach in Phil Jackson. MJ,Pippen and Rodman were not the only people on that team. The bench on that team would be starting on most teams in the NBA right now.
5. If you dont want it to become a biased thread, dont start that by ignoring the facts. wink.gif

K THX
*


1. i gave you facts to..

2.Yes he does and how does kobe in colorado have to do anything about this. (bias move there)

3. YOu implied that lebron is like no good.

4.Okay

5.Im not ignoring the facts.. i think your getting but hurt on this.. no offense but you seem kinda of jumpy.. this is hobby talk... i want to hear facts and other people opinons.. i dont want some nasty arguements... pm me if you do.. or i wont respond on here..

thanks tex
kobelover_24
QUOTE(sgmco @ Oct 28 2008, 05:22 PM)
Anyone who witnessed MJ's career and doesn't rate him the best ever---how can I say it--don't know jack. It's natural that you being a Kobe lover you would rate him above MJ---fact is either you were not there to witness MJ ORRRR you are a true Kobe lover. Either way ask those in the know and MJ will always come out on top.
*


I never said kobe was he best ever.. i said he is up there and has another 7-9 years to play some basketball to get his stats up... im just saying there is alot of players that could be the best ever and i think MJ and kobe are purest shooters ever... But i dont think they are the best ever... I watched alot of classic games.. and im not being bias on this and not trying to make this a dirty thread.. i want everyone to be in a good mood... and just talk basketball and be respecful...
bigalexx
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 06:24 PM)
1. i gave you facts to..
*


Where are the facts? I didn't see any, and I just re-read every one of your posts.
kobelover_24
QUOTE(tex333 @ Oct 28 2008, 05:18 PM)
Then you would see that LeBron and Kobe get almost all the call's.
*


Wow.. your kidding me right?
bigalexx
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 06:29 PM)
Wow.. your kidding me right?
*


Nope, not at all.
kobelover_24
QUOTE(bigalexx @ Oct 28 2008, 05:29 PM)
Where are the facts? I didn't see any, and I just re-read every one of your posts.
*


I gave the facts that chicago wasnt great till the bad boys gotten old.. and when they got a decent coach (tex siad)... And i explain my self and my opinons and my lil facts that i thru in there.. ou kinda got me there on this one though i admitt..
kobelover_24
QUOTE(bigalexx @ Oct 28 2008, 05:31 PM)
Nope, not at all.
*


we can go all day on this statement... lol im going to drop this one...
kobelover_24
Im going to hit the hay.. Ill get back to you guys on this tomorrow.. alright good night
dodgerblue38501
The NBA of Jordan's era and today's NBA are very different animals. In the 80s through the mid 90s the NBA was more of a team game. That is why the 80s Celtics and Showtime Lakers were successful. Everyone wants to talk about Jordan but I would argue that the John Paxons, Steve Kerrs, and BJ Armstrongs of the world were just as important to the team dynamic of those Bulls championship squads. Today it seems that it is more individual oriented with focus on superstar players making a Sports Center moment every night. That is why I enjoy the Spurs and Pistons style of play. They play as a team. They don't have one big superstar that gets all the touches and takes all the shots. Today's players are more physically gifted but basketball in general has changed. That is just a result of changing times. Honestly I can't even sit down and watch the NBA anymore. I follow it through highlight shows. Now it reminds me of playground ball with a guy trying to do trick dribbling and making a poster dunk every play. I also think the character of players turned me off. The 80s guys I grew up watching had character. The guys today for the most part are hip-hop influenced and thuggish in style. There are some exceptions. That is just the vibe I get from the NBA. It's not my style. The players and the style of play has turned me off.There ar some guys I do like: Duncan, Shaq, Nash, CP3, LeBron, Dwight Howard , Dirk, just to name a few. For me though nobody will ever be in the class of Jordan.
kobelover_24
QUOTE(dodgerblue38501 @ Oct 29 2008, 09:24 AM)
The NBA of Jordan's era and today's NBA are very different animals. In the 80s through the mid 90s the NBA was more of a team game. That is why the 80s Celtics and Showtime Lakers were successful. Everyone wants to talk about Jordan but I would argue that the John Paxons, Steve Kerrs, and BJ Armstrongs of the world were just as important to the team dynamic of those Bulls championship squads. Today it seems that it is more individual oriented with focus on superstar players making a Sports Center moment every night. That is why I enjoy the Spurs and Pistons style of play. They play as a team. They don't have one big superstar that gets all the touches and takes all the shots. Today's players are more physically gifted but basketball in general has changed. That is just a result of changing times. Honestly I can't even sit down and watch the NBA anymore. I follow it through highlight shows. Now it reminds me of playground ball with a guy trying to do trick dribbling and making a poster dunk every play. I also think the character of players turned me off. The 80s guys I grew up watching had character. The guys today for the most part are hip-hop influenced and thuggish in style. There are some exceptions. That is just the vibe I get from the NBA. It's not my style. The players and the style of play has turned me off.There ar some guys I do like: Duncan, Shaq, Nash, CP3, LeBron, Dwight Howard , Dirk, just to name a few. For me though nobody will ever be in the class of Jordan.
*


Thats very well said..i cant argue about anything but that nobody will be in jordans class... I have to disagree on that.. i think that he is the purest shooter ever but i just dont think he is the best... But very well said and very hard to argue... lol thanks
tex333
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 07:24 PM)
1. i gave you facts to..

2.Yes he does and how does kobe in colorado have to do anything about this. (bias move there)

3. YOu implied that lebron is like no good.

4.Okay

5.Im not ignoring the facts.. i think your getting but hurt on this.. no offense but you seem kinda of jumpy.. this is hobby talk... i want to hear facts and other people opinons.. i dont want some nasty arguements... pm me if you do.. or i wont respond on here..

thanks tex
*


I gave an example on the Kobe thing. I chose it because I thought it would be something you were familar with. How did I imply LeBron was no good? All I said was I think he's over rated and that he needs to be a good shooter before you can even name him in the class that MJ and Kobe are in. Also, you saying Jordan didn't win anything until the "bad boys got old" is bogus. Several of them were still at a comptetitive age. Also, how was I being biased giving you an example that you would be familar with? unsure.gif
tex333
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 02:21 PM)

JORDAN
Did you watch jordan when he was nobody? did you watch him when he used to get killed by the pistons? After everyone got old. lakers, pistons, celtics and everyone retired or was after there prime.. Jordan didnt make a name for himself till everyone left or was old.. If jordan was playing with chris paul, kobe, lebron, KG..etc he would be not the best player ever.. there was no one amazing in the 90's ... Im not saying MJ was trash but he IS NOT the best basketball player ever.. Some people forget about MAGIC< BIRD< CHAMBERLAIN<KOBE<LEBRON<DR.J...etc i can go on all day.. MJ was in his prime when there was no one that was great like him.. all im saying he is not the best ever
*


I dont see any fact's in this post.

QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 07:06 PM)
So as i see you dont like lebron.. you think he is trash? I wasnt born when mj was in his prime.. but i watch alot of classic games and just listen around to old timers.. I just dont think mj is the best ever.. When he was loosing to the detroit bad boys he gave up.. Pippen and mj were out of there game.. they couldnt beat them.. mj faking like he was hurt... pippen didnt want to play ethier.. intill detroit,lakers,celtics etc gotten old and out of there prime.. You here of MJ and the chicago bulls.. Then they went on there roll finally beating the bad boys.. Thhen Rodman help pippen and jordan a ton to help mj get his titles... im not saying mj is trash i think he was just the only great player in the 90's and if he was playing in the nba now he wouldnt be the best basketball player..
*


Or this one. Please let me know if I missed any of the facts you posted. Thanks
Kmart6nets
If you replaced Kobe with MJ at the same age in last year's finals, there is NO WAY that embarrassing joke of an outcome is the same in game 6. Anyone who knows MJ knows he does NOT get embarrassed like that. At this point I really don't think you can compare Kobe and MJ based purely on their level of competitiveness (think back to Lakers-Suns game 7 as well). Lebron obviously has a long way to go still, but if he can work on his overall shooting (jumper AND FTs), he can approach that level quickly. MJ is undoubtedly a top five player of all time. Kobe might not be in the top 15.
msuwendy
I really agree with what Chad had to say. In a way, it's almost pointless trying to compare players from different generations simply because so much has changed: the way the game is played, the way players train, rules, physical characteristics, etc.

Players have gotten much more physical, stronger and faster. At the same time, many players in the NBA these days can't shoot to save their lives (just look at what happens in international tournaments). They rely almost purely on their physical ability to muscle their way to the basket. The art of the jumpshot is slowly dying.

For comparisons sake, I don't think MJ was the greatest pure shooter either....IMO, I think players like Larry Bird and Reggie Miller were better pure shooters than MJ. What made MJ stand out for me was the fact that he always DEMANDED more from the players around him and he simply had a special ability to take over a game like no one I've ever seen. Sometimes, watching with the ball in his hand is like watching the game in slow-motion. Opposing defenders know what's going to happen, but they still cannot do a thing to stop it.

I also happen to think that the league had a ton of very good players in their prime when the Bulls competed for all those championships. Malone and Stockton anyone? Probably the greatest PG-PF combo in history.

MJ forced his teammates to play above their ability consistently throughout an entire season(s). Until Kobe and Lebron display the ability to do that on a consistent basis, they are not at MJ's level yet IMO.
metsfan2427
Jordan hands down no question.
Bryant has had a great career but he has done alot of stupid stuff off the court that has really hurt his image.
Also Bryant doesn't share the ball. MJ learned to. Which also made him a better player basketball is a team sport no an i sport.
Mike Lindegarde
I have more of a question than a statement. I was a little to young to pay attention to the rules when I saw Jordan play....

Didn't Jordan plan in an era without zone defense? In other words, if Jordan got to play isolation basektball most of his career. In today's NBA, players such as Kobe and LeBron get doubled all of the time. To slam against a good zone team they have to beat the man covering them at the top of the key and the man under the hoop that is 7 feet tall.

I'm not arguing who is better here, just asking: doesn't the fact that Jordan played in an era with an entirely different defensive style play into this discusion?

Also, living in Cleveland and watching the Cavaliers play game after game, it kills me to watch LeBron at the end of the game. It's a given, he's going to puond the ball at the top of the key until 3 seconds are left, then drive the line expecting a foul (he rarely finishes the shot). If he does get the call, then he goes to the stripe and bricks the shots needed to tie or win the game.

Although LeBron scores a lot of points in the fourth quarter (he has to... no one else on the team is going to do it), he never closes a game.
stormfan7
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 03:21 PM)

SG-kobe 6 6' 220 pounds-Purest shooter ever in the NBA.

JORDAN
Did you watch jordan when he was nobody?


*



1. Kobe is not even the purest shooter in the NBA right now...that goes to Jesus Shuttlesworth, I mean Ray Allen. Michael Redd, Steve Nash, and Ben Gordon are even better shooters than Kobe.

Kobe might be the best scorer ever, but not shooter.

2. Sorry, I didn't get a chance to watch Jordan when he was cut during his SOPHOMORE year of high school...I think that was the only time when he was a 'nobody'

3. Jordan is so far ahead of any guard/small forward that ever played the game that it's not even funny.


Here is my breakdown of Kobe/LeBron:

Last year, LeBron was probably the better OVERALL player (but hardly anyone would admit it)
During the Olympics, LeBron was unquestionable the team leader (and everyone started mentioning it)
This year, LeBron will prove he is the better OVERALL player (and everyone will talk about it)

miles.ngo
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 05:06 PM)
before i answer tex i want to here why you think he is the best guys... alright tex your up..

So as i see you dont like lebron.. you think he is trash? I wasnt born when mj was in his prime.. but i watch alot of classic games and just listen around to old timers.. I just dont think mj is the best ever.. When he was loosing to the detroit bad boys he gave up.. Pippen and mj were out of there game.. they couldnt beat them.. mj faking like he was hurt... pippen didnt want to play ethier.. intill detroit,lakers,celtics etc gotten old and out of there prime.. You here of MJ and the chicago bulls.. Then they went on there roll finally beating the bad boys.. Thhen Rodman help pippen and jordan a ton to help mj get his titles... im not saying mj is trash i think he was just the only great player in the 90's and if he was playing in the nba now he wouldnt be the best basketball player..
Also i dont want this to be a bias thread just becuase you like lebron/kobe/jordan that you think one of them are the best.. i want to hear why you think they are and some facts...

Thanks alot tex
*




You talk about Jordan needing help to win his titles, but what about Kobe? Kobe hasn't won a title without help from Shaq yet. When he finally got to the Finals again, what changed from previous years? He had help from a supporting cast, Gasol, Fisher, Odom..it's not a one man game.
abnsnyper
user posted image
snkpoct137
QUOTE(kobelover_24 @ Oct 28 2008, 09:11 PM)
Utah jazz game when he hit that buzzer shot to beat them.. he pushed off.. they dont call offenses of fouls on him.. but if lebron or kobe push off there calling a offensive foul and the jazz would of gotten the championship... im saying they wont let you gaurd mj they call ticky tack fouls..
*



im pretty sure he didnt push off laugh.gif

when Kobe gets a few more rings we can compare them again
tex333
QUOTE(snkpoct137 @ Nov 1 2008, 01:00 PM)
im pretty sure he didnt push off  laugh.gif

when Kobe gets a few more rings we can compare them again
*


Hell when Kobe gets one without Shaq we can talk. wink.gif
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2014 Invision Power Services, Inc.