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> War! What Is It Good For?, Afghanistan and Iraq? time to fire

RGBII
post Jan 5 2011, 10:27 PM
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. . . this forum up once again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01-2pNCZiNk...ayer_detailpage

I picked this particular video due to its reliance
on the performer, not the act(s) of war.

Folks, the people that attacked us on 9/11 are dead.
The folks that are/were their comrades are dead.

4,300+ men and women have died in this quest for huge
profits of the military/industrial complex (that's in Iraq).
1,448+ have died in Afghanistan.

So, pray tell, why are we spending our next generation
of warriors and $2,000,000,000.00 per day to support this?

Simple question, I would admire some simple answers.

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post Jan 5 2011, 11:09 PM
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because we the people have elected people to our legislative and executive branches of our government who dont know how to quit!

but the simply answer would just be because!


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post Jan 5 2011, 11:24 PM
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QUOTE(aceecards @ Jan 5 2011, 11:09 PM)
because we the people have elected people to our legislative and executive branches of our government who dont know how to quit!

but the simply answer would just be because!
*


Impressive answer, I'm still befuddled.

*I edited this editorial comment. It was not
necessary nor useful in this discussion.

Can someone give me an intellegent, well-researched,
reasoning for the multiple wars that we (the American voiting
public) are responsile for?

I believe that the real answer lies too close to home.

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RGBII


This post has been edited by RGBII: Jan 6 2011, 08:52 PM



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cdoyal
post Jan 6 2011, 11:21 AM
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QUOTE(RGBII @ Jan 5 2011, 10:27 PM)

4,300+ men and women have died in this quest for huge
profits of the military/industrial complex (that's in Iraq).

*



When you start with this premise, I doubt any answer will satisfy you.

Also, I think you have too many zeros in your post. It's $2 million per day - not $2 billion.


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post Jan 6 2011, 12:20 PM
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Richard,

I believe that I can answer your call for an answer. While I loathe every minute that I have spent in this God Forsaken pit of sewage, there is a good reason why we are still here. Please let me explain.

Whether we had a just reason to enter a war with Iraq or Afghanistan is no longer the question. I have seen enough war to last me the rest of my grandchildrens life and I am still wondering the answer to that one. The real question that everyone asks but dosent want to truth about is "Why are we still here"?

We are still here because, quite frankly, its the right thing to do. Having been blown up twice and shot three times in the chest, I have every reason to hate the people of Iraq and not care as to what there future holds. But for every bad experience I have had here, I have 10 good ones. The smile on a small childs face when you hand them a piece of candy is priceless. Even better is when kids cry joyful tears because you gave them a backpack filled with books and paper. These children are the future of Iraq. If we turned our backs on them while Iraq is still in the rebuilding process, we doom them to turn out just like their elders: bitter, anti-western civilization extremeists, Ultimatley dooming our children and grandchildren into the same fate.

I hate being here with every fiber of my body, but if my being here until the Iraqi people are able to fend for themselves and act as a nation will help ensure that we dont ever have to come back, then so be it!

Long story short, we must ensure that we do everything in our power to make these people not continue hating the United States (and we are getting there, people!). Just or not, we entered this war and now we must to the right thing and ensure that we will not have to return again in a few years (reference the early 90's when we should have finished Saddam off the first time!).

Like it or not, this is how it is from somone with first hand knowledge and experience!

-Sarge

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post Jan 6 2011, 12:29 PM
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The US believes it's their right to step into other countries and basically reshape that system if it goes against their "code," regardless of the costs associated with it. Throughout the past hundred years or so, the US has been incredibly war hawkish and I don't think that'll change in the near future.

That's certainly no justification to it, and I am completely in agreement with you on this, Richard, but it's one of the main reasons for it nonetheless.


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post Jan 6 2011, 12:44 PM
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QUOTE(coltsfan23 @ Jan 6 2011, 12:29 PM)
The US believes it's their right to step into other countries and basically reshape that system if it goes against their "code," regardless of the costs associated with it. Throughout the past hundred years or so, the US has been incredibly war hawkish and I don't think that'll change in the near future.
*



That's simply a load of bull. It's amazing what some people want to believe about their country. My patience with this kind of garbage is pretty thin right now.

Richard asks a valid question (and provided his own answer) and this is the kind of response we get?


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post Jan 6 2011, 01:19 PM
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QUOTE(cdoyal @ Jan 6 2011, 11:44 AM)
That's simply a load of bull. It's amazing what some people want to believe about their country. My patience with this kind of garbage is pretty thin right now.

Richard asks a valid question (and provided his own answer) and this is the kind of response we get?
*



It's my opinion. You may not agree with it, but that doesn't mean it's "garbage." I don't agree with quite a few of your political posts, but I respect your opinions and don't go trolling calling them garbage, do I?


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post Jan 6 2011, 01:32 PM
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QUOTE(coltsfan23 @ Jan 6 2011, 11:29 AM)
The US believes it's their right to step into other countries and basically reshape that system if it goes against their "code," regardless of the costs associated with it. Throughout the past hundred years or so, the US has been incredibly war hawkish and I don't think that'll change in the near future.

That's certainly no justification to it, and I am completely in agreement with you on this, Richard, but it's one of the main reasons for it nonetheless.
*



While I respect everyones opinion, I must ask you to explain this to me. In the past hundred years worth or wars, what war have we fought to change a countries system to reflect that of our own?

WWI?

WWII? (I believe this one was due to the countless MURDERS of US Military during Pearl Harbour)

Korea?

Vietnam?

Both of which were fought for no gain to us, but rather to stop a power hungry society from decimating another for ITS own benifit.

Somalia? Dont get me started. We lost men over there to save countless murders. Even if we got our fourth point of contact kicked!

Desert Storm?


Just my opinion, which by the way is backed by more time in combat than 99% of Americans will ever serve in the military! And I am by no means a person who enjoys war. I just understand them and dont make judgements without knowing a little bit about it first!


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post Jan 6 2011, 02:03 PM
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QUOTE(sasports @ Jan 6 2011, 12:32 PM)
While I respect everyones opinion,  I must ask you to explain this to me.  In the past hundred years worth or wars, what war have we fought to change a countries system to reflect that of our own? 

WWI?

WWII?  (I believe this one was due to the countless MURDERS of US Military during Pearl Harbour)

Korea?

Vietnam? 

Both of which were fought for no gain to us, but rather to stop a power hungry society from decimating another for ITS own benifit.

Somalia?  Dont get me started.  We lost men over there to save countless murders.  Even if we got our fourth point of contact kicked!

Desert Storm? 
Just my opinion, which by the way is backed by more time in combat than 99% of Americans will ever serve in the military!  And I am by no means a person who enjoys war.  I just understand them and dont make judgements without knowing a little bit about it first!
*



Shawn,

I certainly respect what you've done for the country, so I'd like to say that first.

However, I realize now that I started something I probably should not have, so I'll be PMing you my response to your questions.


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post Jan 6 2011, 02:30 PM
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Ankesh,

Thanks for the response. And as I said in the PM, no worries. I dont get mad about opinions. Everyone is entitled to theirs and according to their beliefs, their opinion is right whether it is by my belief or not. No use in getting upset over it! I do however expect somone to explain their opinion if it is different than mine so that I might better understand where they are coming from! I appreciate your PM and opinion!

-Sarge


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man your hardcore if you bust the box in the parking lot..
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post Jan 6 2011, 02:30 PM
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QUOTE(coltsfan23 @ Jan 6 2011, 01:19 PM)
It's my opinion. You may not agree with it, but that doesn't mean it's "garbage." I don't agree with quite a few of your political posts, but I respect your opinions and don't go trolling calling them garbage, do I?
*



But when an "opinion" is so obviously false, it deserves to be pointed out.


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post Jan 6 2011, 02:39 PM
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QUOTE(cdoyal @ Jan 6 2011, 01:30 PM)
But when an "opinion" is so obviously false, it deserves to be pointed out.
*



So how is an opinion obviously false? An opinion is neither a fact or a lie, its an opinion. Saying someones opinion is false is like saying that somones religion is false. You may believe somthing different than me, so does that make your opinions false?

I am not singling you out, I am meerly making a point! If you dont like Ankeshs opinion, then by all means counter with your opinion with what you believe to be true and factual. It will go a lot further towards this conversation being both educational and fruitful than trying to call him out and attack his opinion. wink.gif

-Sarge


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post Jan 6 2011, 03:05 PM
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QUOTE(sasports @ Jan 6 2011, 02:39 PM)
So how is an opinion obviously false?  An opinion is neither a fact or a lie, its an opinion.  Saying someones opinion is false is like saying that somones religion is false. You may believe somthing different than me, so does that make your opinions false?

I am not singling you out, I am meerly making a point! If you dont like Ankeshs opinion, then by all means counter with your opinion with what you believe to be true and factual.  It will go a lot further towards this conversation being both educational and fruitful than trying to call him out and attack his opinion. wink.gif

-Sarge
*



Fair enough. His post just caught me in a weak moment.
I see statements like this as simply bomb throwing. (pardon the metaphor) People throw out provacative statements (or opinions if you prefer) without any clarification then get all indignant when they're called on it. Common sense and reasoning says it's false. Everyone is entitled to speak their opinion but they aren't entitled to be taken seriously.
Are we at a point in American society where people can make idiotic statements and we have to sit back and honor it with reasoned thought because they are "entitled to their opinion"? Harry Reid's "The war is lost.." speech comes to mind. When someone says something absurd, they deserved to be called on it.

Enough of my rambling...
You stated the reason for being in Iraq better than anyone else I've heard and I certainly can't add anything to it. Well said.


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post Jan 8 2011, 08:27 PM
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My honest thinking is very simple... Money! One way or another. It might be oil, it might be having investments over there for future returns, weapons dealers, the natural gas pipe line (not 100% sure if this is true or not) in Afghanistan, maybe something else. But I personally think its about the money in one way or another! Thats how I truly feel. wink.gif


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post Jan 8 2011, 09:14 PM
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To some degree, I agree with you. In the begining, our current war with Iraq may have been about money. Afghanistan, well we all know why with started blowing them up (a little thing called 9/11). I think that a lot of the Iraq war was originally based on money but the Government soon learned that this is one war that didnt boost the economy like most and that it was actually destroying the USA. Thats another reason the US is pushing to pull out of Iraq. First time you will ever hear me say I agree with a Democrat!


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post Jan 8 2011, 09:51 PM
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QUOTE(sasports @ Jan 8 2011, 09:14 PM)
To some degree, I agree with you.  In the begining, our current war with Iraq may have been about money. 
*



I find it interesting that so many people think the war was about money when there's no shred of evidence pointing in that direction. In this day and age with secrets impossible to keep, you'd think an email, phone call, letter, etc. would surface. It says more about people's cynicism towards governent and politicians than the truth.
Say what you will about George Bush but the guy was motivated by principles and there's no way he'd have thousands of Americans killed for money. If you believe that, I truly feel sad for you.


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post Jan 8 2011, 10:25 PM
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Wrong answers, all of you gentlemen.

The correct answer is the Morticians of the world.

I am not as concerned with Bush's motives as I
am those of the true architects of the mess in Iraq.
Cheney and Wolfowitz, now I'd like to see either
or both in the dock for about seven hours of
questioning from a very fine and rabid lawyer.

Yes, as a matter of fact, I would pay money to
witness that little scene.

Collect Hard!,
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post Jan 8 2011, 10:32 PM
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QUOTE(RGBII @ Jan 8 2011, 10:25 PM)
Wrong answers, all of you gentlemen.

The correct answer is the Morticians of the world.

I am not as concerned with Bush's motives as I
am those of the true architects of the mess in Iraq.
Cheney and Wolfowitz, now I'd like to see either
or both in the dock for about seven hours of
questioning from a very fine and rabid lawyer.

Yes, as a matter of fact, I would pay money to
witness that little scene.

Collect Hard!,
RGBII

*



Again - not a single shred of evidence. Just an emotional hatred for another human being.


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post Jan 8 2011, 10:41 PM
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Look, I have enough therapists and medications.

Your amateur psychoanalysis is not warranted nor
solicited. How can you possibly know what is in my
heart or my emotions concerning any other human
being?

My words have absolutely no hint of your bizarre
interpretation.

Do I need to include a couple of phone number
for you to use at your earliest convenience?

Collect Hard!,
RGBII



Bucket #1 * Bucket #2
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Lo-Fi Version Time: 11th July 2014 - 11:35 PM
  

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