Outline · [ Standard ] · Linear+ What about Bob?

[chopinalex]

Box Breaks made me go broke!!! I took a hiatus and then was forced into retirement after a failed comeback attempt.

let's do a topps total case break like good old times....

[bajmurray]

let's do a topps total case break like good old times....

Naw......let's do Pro Set Hockey!

[northicehero99]

Naw......let's do Pro Set Hockey!

I am sure someone out there would be more then willing to sell you those boxes.

[chopinalex]

Naw......let's do Pro Set Hockey!

Funny i still had some of those bixes i still might

[Iplayfootball_90]

Hope everything is going well for Bob, I know he hasn't been around in quite some time.


Cheers.

[19th Century Indiana Jones]

We used to be a tiny village by the shoreline. We grew into a metropolis. What's left are a few inhabitants living in the remnants of a civilization almost long gone.

But why is the sacrificial altar still wet?

[2000 rushing yards]

Hey everyone! Man it's been a while since I've posted on here. I was on here today to look up some information, after reading a Beckett, I want to try for the supercollectors contest for my Orioles collection. I came across this post, like many others I believe the interest for the hobby is not there anymore. My life now is more absorbed my college, potential jobs, hanging out, than cards back when I was 16-18 years old. None of my friends collect seriously anymore; I even notice it at my local hobby shop. When I first started going to a PackWars there, back in 2006 or so, there were around 30 people, the demand was so high, he sold "reserve" tickets, which were more of a stand-by ticket than anything else, and there was free pizza! I went to a PackWars back in may and saw 15-20 people, and no free pizza .
How this translates into TCC, I don't know. I do see some good activity here, and all of you moderators do seem to be doing a great job to trying to keep it active. I do believe, if Bob does come back, there will be a resurgence in activity, many looked up to him. For right now though, we need to have the teens in this country get more involved in collecting. They are the ones that would be most interested in posting here, I feel and be able to right the ship.

[mjda]

I do believe, if Bob does come back, there will be a resurgence in activity, many looked up to him.

I don't think it was much people looking up to Bob as it was people respecting Bob. Bob got a lot of respect on this site, and mostly because he treated everyone else with respect. Bob had a set of rules for this site, and he simply asked that everyone follow those rules. He also didn't tend to hold grudges against those who broke the rules a few times, and I never once saw him try to enforce a "rule" that didn't exist.

When Bob left, so did his common sense approach to leading this site, shortly followed by the respect of the entire CZT.

...and that's all I have to say, about that.

[urbanmonk]

Well guess I"m at the end of my rope with the Mod bashing. Those of you that don't like it why do you even bother to come here? Or is that your only purpose to come here? Yeah you guys have posted this kind of stuff and we still let you stay here even though you guys show up once in a blue moon, guess that was a mistake and we should have done that differently.
I stuck around not because Bob owed me money but because I liked the people here. He left with no warning or explanation, just went AWOL, and we didn't have access to/knowledge on the things we needed to properly do our job. Nor would he return phone calls, emails or anything from any of the Team members at the beginning at all. We did our best with what we had and what we was given. Folks didn't like it oh well, they could go to some of the other sites with all their send first rules and other rules that we don't have here. It is not only a thankless job but you have to take a raft of crap from folks when you asking them kindly to not do something or when you are trying to help them with a transaction. So I guess when the last CZT bothers with trying to do anything here, the masses can do whatever they please and folks won't have anything to beotch about....well except no help with transactions gone south or anything else they need help with. Said I wasn't going to be the last rat jumping off the sinking ship, so guess most folks I communicate with here know where to find me already on other avenues. I don't have access to the controls to unban all the ashats and scammers, or to remove my own account, so I don't have any of those options available to me.
Tired of the Mods stink and Bob was great stuff, well he didn't leave us so great and guess what he hasn't been here in over two years and I had to put him on CTO. Anyone else left folks hanging like that with transactions would have probably been banned by his very own rules, and yes I will admit I cut him more slack so wasn't unbiased, but everything else I did here I treated or tried to treat the same way. Not like the folks that have been removed didn't have plenty of chances, they made their choices on how they responded and in some cases ignored our requests, so they dug their own hole far as I'm concerned.

It's been real, it's been fun.....but it hasn't been real fun.....

[northicehero99]

I don't think it was much people looking up to Bob as it was people respecting Bob. Bob got a lot of respect on this site, and mostly because he treated everyone else with respect. Bob had a set of rules for this site, and he simply asked that everyone follow those rules. He also didn't tend to hold grudges against those who broke the rules a few times, and I never once saw him try to enforce a "rule" that didn't exist.

When Bob left, so did his common sense approach to leading this site, shortly followed by the respect of the entire CZT.

...and that's all I have to say, about that.

I think your first statements about Bob are accurate, however he did hold grudges against those who wouldn't grow up. I can think of a few who he gave the boot, that were never allowed to return even after numerous requests. After Bob left, I think that his approach was still followed as best as could be, however it was kind of hard for CZT to lead if not given items to correct issues (see main page, viruses, etc.). Anyway, it is what it is and he still has not returned, so the site will continue to be what it has been recently unless those of us posting make an effort to change it and stop dwelling on has beens and what ifs.

[bajmurray]

There are times when I'd like to suggest to the complainers that if they don't like it here, perhaps they should go out and create their own site, with the rules that they think are appropriate.

Oh, wait a minute.........


Someone DID try that.....



How's that working our for them?????

[ffman]

Well put Dwight.

Bob was a main factor in the success of this site, but also a part of its downfall. He was faced with more important life issues, so it's no question that he should focus on those instead of the site. That said, his departure was rather abrupt and he didn't leave the CZT with the necessary tools and information.

[mjda]

There are times when I'd like to suggest to the complainers that if they don't like it here, perhaps they should go out and create their own site, with the rules that they think are appropriate.

Oh, wait a minute.........
Someone DID try that.....
How's that working our for them?????

You were there weren't you?

I'm sure it probably would be working out a lot better if that person's wife hadn't had to see numerous doctors for suspicion of breast cancer.

[mjda]

That said, his departure was rather abrupt and he didn't leave the CZT with the necessary tools and information.

To be fair, though, he did leave (complete) access to the site with the leader of the Content and Graphics Team. I know this to be a fact, because at the time he left that person was me. Then, when I quit the team, I passed that same access on to the current CGT leader as well as to Richard.

[urbanmonk]

To be fair, though, he did leave (complete) access to the site with the leader of the Content and Graphics Team. I know this to be a fact, because at the time he left that person was me. Then, when I quit the team, I passed that same access on to the current CGT leader as well as to Richard.

Richard had no clue how to use it as didn't get a walk thru and not totally his forte (strong suit) either (least that is my understanding of it), and CGT had other things going on so they wasn't here at all for a long stretch of time. Then the Sever was changed and we wasn't given the codes or who to contact, and not even notified that it had changed, so when the "virus" thing showed up Richard had to try and figure out who to contact about it, and he didn't have permission to act on the sites behalf, etc.....etc..., was never ending series of roadblocks and walls for awhile. So yeah it was all kinds of being in a life boat with no oars, and holes showing up in the bottom of the boat and no sight of land anywhere on the horizon. So was stressful at the very least to try and carry on so to speak without the tools/training to do so successfully, as trying to fly blind never really bodes well, along with the uncertainty of if we were just wasting our time trying to keep the ship afloat, as it could go poof w/o any warning.

[mjda]

My point was simply that Bob cannot be solely to blame, and the "he left us with nothing" excuse is simply not true. That server access worked for a good year after Bob had disappeared and still nothing was done with it. The guys who had it, myself included, simply wasted the opportunity to use it while they had it.

Also, even without access to the server itself, there have always been people with other access to make changes to the forum.

The virus was a bad deal, I'll give you that one, but all of this site's traffic didn't leave because of a virus. Heck, a lot of people would have never even known about it had they not seen the threads about it.

The real problem, and it was a problem even when Bob was here is that there are too many "squatters" and talkers on the team, and not enough doers. I'm certainly not talking about you there either, Dwight, because I know you personally would do whatever you had the authority to do.

The fact is, though, that it is just disheartening to those who do actually do things on the team to look around and see a lot of other people who could be doing the same things doing nothing. I think that caused a lot of the team to start looking at this site more like a job, instead of like a place to relax. Then, it just escalated from there.

There really is no single person, or specific group of people, who can be blamed for the decline of activity. It's really just a combination of a lot of things.

[urbanmonk]

Agreed it was a combination of things, some that have been noted and others that haven't, and really a mute point anyway at this point. A lot of it was that this site was Bob's baby and we didn't have his permission at first to make changes as we saw fit, be it in advertising or other changes that could have helped potentially (one will never know). It would have helped if we knew why he was gone and if he was coming back and when, as we all thought it was short-term and obviously as it has been over 2 years that was a pipe dream.

When Brian stepped down we lost some of the Balance in management (not that anything wrong with anyone, just he balanced things here far as the Team went (and really it works better to have extremes in point of view for making decisions as you can find a middle easier and he was that much of the time), but he had his reasons and it is fully understood). Yes a lot of it was having a large Team while in reality only a handful of us actually doing majority of the work. After a few topics of asking for opinions from the Team, and I get 2 answers for feedback in a week, I just started doing whatever I felt was needed when issues came up (as you can't wait that long on some things), and sure others felt that too when they were trying to do things as a Team yet hard to do w/o opinions on whatever the subject at hand is, as it is easy to develop a "it don't matter as apparently I'm the only one that gives a crud" attitude.

Again really all a mute point at this point anyway. The folks that come here for GB's is major reason folks even come here as can be told by looking at the transaction forums. Used to take me up to an hour a day to keep that area in order, now pretty much non-existent with exception to the GB's. I'm beyond being able to be optimistic anymore far as the site is concerned, and would have stepped down awhile back but Richard wouldn't remove my title. And I don't have access to the things to do it myself, or just remove myself from site as one Mod did, he is doing better w/o it as we talk via Email from time to time, and I'm starting to wonder if I may be in the same boat as he was at this point in time. As you can look at the members that have been on in last 24hrs and up to 40% of them are Bots and Spammers with no posts that haven't been approved for membership, and that list is pages and pages from what I hear, as Bob used to do all the approvals and nobody was enlightened into how he sorted out the chaff from the legit folks in order to make it not an arduous task that once you behind you can't dig your way out.

[road_runner_1964]

So, I have refrained from engaging in this thread and discussion, as pretty much all has been said, debated, whatever, but the fact remains that there are a handful of individuals that can do what they can and that is pretty much it. I choose to continue to provide some over-sight, as I accepted a task and refuse to let meaningless individuals sway me from doing them. Don't take offense folks, but there are people here (and elsewhere) have made it there mission to harass and follow individuals to other forums, because they were administered some form of discipline/censoring, something. Remember rtsjr?

I didn't sign up for that....so I choose to keep my trap shut.

Dwight, if you really, really want the removal of rights and title, let me know. I believe I have that ability. But, I will probably follow suit and we won't have to worry about group breaks anymore, because no one will be able to approve them.

[urbanmonk]

Bob, will lyk. Not officially off the fence yet, but think my sock got hung up on it and I'm currently hanging upside down and unsure if I want to climb back up or not. So this will be my last post for the time being, and I won't fall under "active" far as things go with decisions/actions at this time.
Not going to comment in this thread anymore, though I will leave it open even though I have inclinations to not do so.

[northicehero99]

To be fair, though, he did leave (complete) access to the site with the leader of the Content and Graphics Team. I know this to be a fact, because at the time he left that person was me. Then, when I quit the team, I passed that same access on to the current CGT leader as well as to Richard.

Michael here is a typical example of something that was not communicated. I had no idea that you had "complete" access and what I find funny about that is that I was "co-manager" of the CZT and did not know. There was not a lot of communication prior to his departure and that may have been due to Bob beleiving his departure would be temporary?? Either way, it might have helped if we had know who could do what and find a way to parse it out.

In addition, I agree there were members of the teams who did and others who did not "participate". There again though that is the nature of a donated time team. My free time is as important to me as other members is to them. If you are being paid nothing to be here and others are supposed to help, but don't it is very discouraging for those doing all the work.

As for the sites decline, I don't blame Bob for it all, but as others have said it is hard to guide a ship if you don't have a rudder or you have one, but don't have access to the controls to steer it (or it is not communicated that others do have access).

I think the virus was the major "crash" of the site as nobody had access to stop it or fix it. I know several people had their computers crashed because of it and those types of things keep people away. People kept posting about that issue, but nothing was fixed for a good while which hurt as people were afraid to come back as the risk of losing a $500 computer or having to pay to have it fix was just not worth it.

In addition, there were members here who felt they were the end all - be all of the site and that the mods should "stroke their egos" for them and when that did not happen they took and started issues with the CZT and when all else failed they took their clicks with them and left. I am not saying the CZT was perfect in these issues, but as noted earlier grown men acting like children can really get to you especially if you are not being "paid" to be a babysitter and the site no longer is relaxing to you.