Outline · [ Standard ] · Linear+ Obama's plan?, an interesting read by MR Root....

[jkseb1972]

So keeping the rich alive and letting the poor die is a better economic system? Universal healthcare is nothing but extending the basic right to life to people who can't afford it. If wealth becomes so concentrated that only the wealthy can afford to stay alive, then the wealth NEEDS to be distributed. Allowing the poor to suffer and die because they don't have enough pieces of paper in their pocket is so disgusting there are no words for it.

You're a Christian, right? WHAT WOULD JESUS DO?

I don't seem to remember any point in the Bible where he denied care to somebody because they were poor.

what would Jesus do? are you serious? In this country, people without insurance get seen every day. I am a healthcare provider and see people without insurance on a daily basis. Medicare is spending millions a day to see people without healthcare, and never are you turned away from an emergency room because you don't have insurance. The whole argument that there are millions and millions of people without health incurance is very misleading. of the millions uninsurred, a very large portion are illegal aliens or people who could afford ins but opt not to.

Jesus was never a proponent of laziness. he asked people to work and have faith before he blessed them. if we go offering free healthcare to people we will just be enabling them to be lazy. ever hear of the parable of the talents?
he gave a number of talents (money) to three individuals. days later, he returned and asked what had become of their gifted talents. one man used his to make more money and grew his handfull of talets to double what he had. another buried his in the ground and did nothing with it. Jesus then took the sole talent form the poor man with only one and gave it to the man with many, rewarding his good work and punishing the lazy man. no free gifts for him. This country is full of lazy men!

why should i work, i'll just collect my gov't assistance checks, wait till my food stamps come in and sit back with my free health insurance. what is my motivation to work?

It used to be that this was the country where a man could work by the sweat of his brow and become whatever he wanted, now we work by the sweat of our brow to support those who rather play and prey off others efforts.this mentality will cripple an already weak economy

Not to mention the shotty socialized healthcare systems we see in other countries. what good is healthcare when you need to be waitlisted for 6 months before you can see a doc?

[rnpurdue]

Well said, Joe. I am an ER nurse in downtown Houston and I truly understand how you feel. Without prompting more WWJD criticism or "we should take care of our poor", maybe some of these people should come to work with us and see how these "poor" really live. Then they can see first hand the dozens of people DAILY that abuse, manipulate and fraudulently use the health care system.

[jkseb1972]

Well said, Joe.  I am an ER nurse in downtown Houston and I truly understand how you feel.  Without prompting more WWJD criticism or "we should take care of our poor", maybe some of these people should come to work with us and see how these "poor" really live.  Then they can see first hand the dozens of people DAILY that abuse, manipulate and fraudulently use the health care system.

it's funny, i see multiple patients every day who have government healthcare and they show up in their Air Jordans while talking on their iphones. explain that!

[RGBII]

The cries of tyranny and blanket socialism by those
on the right and far right ring very hollow to me. Our
country has been subsidizing industries for years.

The Sugar Industry

The sugar industry has been subsidized by the U.S.
Government since 1816. Under President James Madison,
and supported by Henry Clay, the act was seen as a
way to combat the British manufacturers of iron and
textiles. The 25% tariff also included sugar, which was
a bone thrown to the new settlers of the Louisiana
Purchase territories.

The 1934 government imposed sugar import quotas
to further enhance the profits of the sugar industry.
A Democratic Congress did abolish the quotas in
1974. In 1982, President Ronald Reagen (a
well-known spokesman for "free markets") reimposed
the sugar quotas.

"Since 1980, the sugar program has cost consumers
and taxpayers the equivalent of more than $3 million for
each American sugar grower."
Future of Freedom Foundation

The Dairy Industry

The U.S. Dairy Program, administered by the USDA and
State governments, subsidizes milk production and
regulates dairy prices.

"The program cost the U.S. taxpayers $4 billion a year."
The Cato Institute

The Tobacco Industry

While the federal government was suing the tobacco
industry for deceiving the public, they also doled out
a great deal of taxpayer money to prop up the farms
and their toxic product.

For 70 years, we, the U.S. taxpayers have been
keeping the price of tobacco stable through
price supports. When the crop went to market,
if it did not meet a pre-ordained price, the government
made up the difference in direct payments.

The price support program was ended when
President Bush signed the Fair and Equitable
Tobacco Reform Act in 2004. It also created the
Tobacco Transition Payment Program which will
buyout tobacco farmers to the tune of approximately
$18.6 billion a year until 2014.

"Recipients of Tobacco Subsidies from farms in
United States totaled $944,104,000 in from 1995-2009."
Environmental Working Group

The Transportation Industry

Amtrak - Created by Congress and President Richard
Nixon in 1971 and owned by the United States
government as an intercity passenger rail service.

This merry little adventure has cost the taxpayers
$13 billion up to 1997. The stock is owned wholly
by the U.S. Government and its Board of Directors
is chosen by the President of the United States.

Amtrak is funded $2.6 billion a year through 2013.
Rail Safety Improvement Act of 2008
Signed into law by President Bush, October, 16, 2008

The Airline Industry

The U.S. taxpayer has subsidized the airline
industry since Kitty Hawk.

The "Airline Deregulation Act," passed in 1978,
created the Essential Air Service Program. This
was to service small, rural communities with
reliable carriers. The fiscal year 2009 budget
was $123 million. Through the Essential
Airline Service Act, carriers have pocketed
$158,124,582 in taxpayer funds (2010).

The Defense Industry

This is simply too big and disgusting to
post.

I could go on and on, yet I'm sure it wouldn't
matter in the long run. There will still be shrill
screams of "socialist agenda" and the dogma
of a non-existent "free market" from the those
on the right.

From the food on your table to the roads
that you drive, the government has a
financial interest. Whether through direct
payments, tax breaks or low to zero
interest loans, we, the U.S. taxpayers
have subsidized "private" industry since
the beginning of the Republic.

Y'all are free to worship where and what you
please. If it is a "free market" system and the
supposed superiority of an entrepreneurial
enterprise, so be it.

By the very same token, I am free to point
out the hypocrisy and lunacy associated
with that faith and worship.

Collect Hard!,
RGBII

[jkseb1972]

stop all the "copy and paste" garbage. why not make your own arguments for once? but then again, like most liberals, you are just taking what someone else worked for. i guess it's expected.

[RGBII]

stop all the "copy and paste"  garbage. why not make your own arguments for once? but then again, like most liberals, you are just taking what someone else worked for. i guess it's expected.

First and foremost, the words are mine
unless they lie between quotation marks.

Secondly, your stop command will be
disregarded with the same arrogance that
your post displays.

Your generalization will be disregarded
with the same loathing and disrespect that
it deserves.

Collect Hard!,
RGBII

[jkseb1972]

First and foremost, the words are mine
unless they lie between quotation marks.

Secondly, your stop command will be
disregarded with the same arrogance that
your post displays.

Your generalization will be disregarded
with the same loathing and disrespect that
it deserves.

Collect Hard!,
RGBII

you really enjoy using big words. loathing huh? why so much hate? i guess your just trying to sound mature and intelligent. good try.

[ronaldinho0003]

you really enjoy using big words. loathing huh? why so much hate? i guess your just trying to sound mature and intelligent. good try.

He doesn't have to try, he already is.

[RGBII]

you really enjoy using big words. loathing huh? why so much hate? i guess your just trying to sound mature and intelligent. good try.

I enjoy writing and saying exactly what
I mean and meaning exactly what I say
or write. No more, no less.

Collect Hard!,
RGBII

[jkseb1972]

your comment "what would Jesus do?" is what bothers me. to insinuate that your beliefs are Jesus's and that christians should adhere to your political stances under the guise that he helped the poor is offensive to me. Jesus, i'm sure, would have alot of things done different in this world, but let's not bring him into our flawed political system and this rediculous debate.

[bravesfan09]

No wonder I have that guy on ignore...

[cdoyal]

No wonder I have that guy on ignore...

And it's no wonder I don't post here any longer. It's simply not worth the effort.

[stlbaseball15]

what would Jesus do? are you serious? In this country, people without insurance get seen every day. I am a healthcare provider and see people without insurance on a daily basis. Medicare is spending millions a day to see people without healthcare, and never are you turned away from an emergency room because you don't have insurance. The whole argument that there are millions and millions of people without health incurance is very misleading. of the millions uninsurred, a very large portion are illegal aliens or people who could afford ins but opt not to.

Jesus was never a proponent of laziness. he asked people to work and have faith before he blessed them. if we go offering free healthcare to people we will just be enabling them to be lazy. ever hear of the parable of the talents?
he gave a number of talents (money) to three individuals. days later, he returned and asked what had become of their gifted talents. one man used his to make more money and grew his handfull of talets to double what he had. another buried his in the ground and did nothing with it. Jesus then took the sole talent form the poor man with only one and gave it to the man with many, rewarding his good work and punishing the lazy man. no free gifts for him. This country is full of lazy men!

why should i work, i'll just collect my gov't assistance checks, wait till my food stamps come in and sit back with my free health insurance. what is my motivation to work?

It used to be that this was the country where a man could work by the sweat of his brow and become whatever he wanted, now we work by the sweat of our brow to support those who rather play and prey off others efforts.this mentality will cripple an already weak economy

Not to mention the shotty socialized healthcare systems we see in other countries. what good is healthcare when you need to be waitlisted for 6 months before you can see a doc?

1. You can't get long term treatment for an illness in an emergency room. If your wife got diabetes or needed a heart transplant and you didn't have insurance she would be in pretty bad straights.

2. If you're interested in sharing healthcare anecdotes, my mother has been an Emergency Room charge nurse for decades. You are a dentist. I'll leave it at that.

3. I'll talk about my own interpretation of the Bible and the life of Jesus, whether you approve or not. I believe, based on thorough readings of the New Testament in Baptist Bible School as a child and in undergraduate Religion classes, that Jesus did not care about wealth or class distinctions when it came to helping others. I transfer that belief to the conclusion that it is morally wrong to let people die for no reason other than money.

4. There are plenty of people who work, make too much money to qualify for Medicare, yet still cannot afford insurance. There are plenty of people who did work and are now jobless because of economic situations out of their control. Do these people deserve to die? Are they not privileged enough to have a routine checkup at or get an alergy shot?

5.I'm glad you brought up emergency rooms. The fact that so many people clog up emergency rooms with nonemergency matters is exactly one of the reasons healthcare costs continue to skyrocket out of affordability. Yet your solution is to send everybody without insurance there so that the hospital can foot the bill instaed of the rich, hoarding taxpayers like yourself who perpetuate the problem with their own inhumanity, greed, and self-absorbtion.

[stlbaseball15]

"A nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift is approaching spiritual death." - Dr. Martin Luther King

"Of all the forms of inequality, injustice in healthcare is the most shocking and inhumane." - Dr. Martin Luther King

[stlbaseball15]

it's funny, i see multiple patients every day who have government healthcare and they show up in their Air Jordans while talking on their iphones. explain that!

They have grandparents.

[stlbaseball15]

stop all the "copy and paste"  garbage. why not make your own arguments for once? but then again, like most liberals, you are just taking what someone else worked for. i guess it's expected.

Go ahead and say it:

"Your posts are too long."

Why else would you think it was copy and pasted?

[sahetu]

I leave for awhile and the whole place is a mess...

[bravesfan09]

Now this is what I call family unity

[cdoyal]

I leave for awhile and the whole place is a mess...

My thoughts exactly!

[Clary209]

And it's no wonder I don't post here any longer. It's simply not worth the effort.

And I echo those thoughts exactly. Bush/Cheney divided this country so thoroughly that it is next to impossible to discuss anything intelligently or in a calm manner. if one does not use sound bytes then it isn't worth discussing it seems.

BTW, that picture of the dog looks very much like my current one. Life without a lab is almost not worth living.